Agenda and minutes

Surrey Police and Crime Panel
Thursday, 28 June 2018 10.30 am

Venue: Ashcombe Suite, County Hall, Kingston upon Thames, Surrey KT1 2DN

Contact: Angela Guest 

Webcast: View the webcast

Items
No. Item

1/18

ELECTION OF CHAIRMAN

2/18

ELECTION OF VICE CHAIRMAN

    Panel to elect a Vice Chairman for year 2018/19.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Councillor Charlotte Morley was proposed by Councillor Beryl Hunswicks and seconded by Councillor Ken Harwood.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    The Panel agreed the appointment of Councillor Charlotte Morley as Police and Crime Panel Vice Chairman for the Council year 2018/19.

     

3/18

APOLOGIES FOR ABSENCE

4/18

MINUTES OF THE PREVIOUS MEETING - 12 APRIL 2018 pdf icon PDF 95 KB

    To approve the minutes of the previous meeting subject to any amendments.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    The Commissioner pointed out errors in minute 82/17 as given below.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    That the minutes of the meeting held on 12 April 2018 were approved as a correct record subject to the following amendment of minute 82/17:

     

    That the second and third bullet points of paragraph 2 should read:

    ·         Depending on where the new HQ was located, there could be another station located in the east of the county as the current Reigate station was not fit for purpose. If the new HQ was in the Eastern division, this would also be the divisional base and there won’t be another station.

    ·         Woking police station would not be retained but there would still be full operational coverage for the Woking area.

    That in paragraph 3 Reigate Street should read Reigate station.

     

5/18

DECLARATIONS OF INTEREST

    All Members present are required to declare, at this point in the meeting or as soon as possible thereafter

    (i)            Any disclosable pecuniary interests and / or

    (ii)           Other interests arising under the Code of Conduct in respect of any item(s) of business being considered at this meeting

    NOTES:

    ·         Members are reminded that they must not participate in any item where they have a disclosable pecuniary interest

    ·         As well as an interest of the Member, this includes any interest, of which the Member is aware, that relates to the Member’s spouse or civil partner (or any person with whom the Member is living as a spouse or civil partner)

    ·         Members with a significant personal interest may participate in the discussion and vote on that matter unless that interest could be reasonably regarded as prejudicial.

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    None received.

     

6/18

PUBLIC QUESTIONS

    To receive any public questions.

     

    Note:

    Written questions from the public can be submitted no later than seven days prior to the published date of the annual or any ordinary public meeting, for which the Commissioner will be invited to provide a written response by noon on the day before the meeting, which will be circulated to Panel Members and the questioner.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    None received.

     

7/18

POLICE AND CRIME COMMISSIONER'S ANNUAL REPORT pdf icon PDF 45 KB

    The Police Reform and Social Responsibility Act (2011) places a duty on Police and Crime Commissioners to produce an Annual Report. Members of the Panel are asked to comment on the attached annual report prior to its formal publication.

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    1.    Disappointment was expressed by one Member who thought that there was little information regarding tackling particular types of crime in the monthly update of the report.  The Commissioner stated that tackling crime was a high priority and that the Chief Constable would be happy to respond to specific queries at the informal meeting in October.

    2.    There was a general discussion around performance indicators.  The Commissioner reported that the dip in figures two years ago was due to disruption whilst police changes were taking place.  Whilst the number of crimes solved remained static the number of crimes reported had risen which meant that the performance indicator had dropped.  He also pointed out that Surrey’s figures were better than most.

    1. A Member stated that he was supportive of the additional policy officer post in order to reduce re-offending.  The Commissioner explained that he was looking for evidence that work was succeeding in reducing crime and re-offending but it was hard to get the data. He reported that there was a new scheme called Checkpoint which was being worked on for Surrey and would look at offending as well as deferred prosecutions.  The Commissioner also stated that he was happy with the Justice Minister’s decision not to build a further five women’s prisons because locking them up was not good for them or for the community.

     

    There were several queries and comments regarding the 101 service:

     

    4.    A couple of Members had visited the 101 call centre and were very impressed with the set up and how the calls were dealt with. The Commissioner responded that the demand for 101 had increased alongside improvement and he believed it would continue to improve.

    5.    It was stated that when a caller when dials 101 the last option given is to report a crime and asked if this should be the first option and that it had taken 90 seconds listening to all the options to get to the most important one.  The Commissioner reminded the Panel that 101 is a non-emergency number and if a crime was in progress that 999 should be dialled.

    6.    The Panel asked what further public communication could be done.  The Commissioner informed the Panel that the Force had just started re-running an advertising campaign that asked the public to ask themselves if the call they were about to make was a police matter.  Fifty percent of calls were not police related matters.

    1. It was stated that the 101 number goes down at 5pm on a Friday afternoon and callers are told to contact the local authority which is also closed from Friday evening.  The Commissioner stated that the 101 number was a 24-hour service, but he would look into this particular case.  He also pointed out that council’s do have some out of hours services.

    8.    It was asked if the rise in 101 callers was due to police front desks closing and that this would need to be considered in  ...  view the full minutes text for item 7/18

8/18

SURREY POLICE GROUP FINANCIAL REPORT FOR MONTH 12 FINANCIAL YEAR 2017/18 pdf icon PDF 724 KB

    The purpose of this report is to inform the Police & Crime Panel of the Surrey Police Group (i.e. Finances of both the PCC and Chief Constable) financial position as at the year-end 31st March 2018.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    1. It was noted that IT was overspent for the last five to six years and a query about reserves was put to the Commissioner.  The Chief Finance Officer (CFO) responded that general reserves should be maintained at 3%, however the actual figure at this point was just under the 3% and he would continue to monitor this.
    2. In response to a question regarding the gap between February and March over/under spend, the CFO explained some of the reasons for the large jump between underspend and overspend between these months.  He explained that following the merger of finance functions between Sussex and Surrey, both used different IT systems so there were a few difficulties around forecasting.  Additional software was due to be purchased to resolve this issue.  He went on to say that when the IT was in place and working, the financial forecasting would even out.  It was admitted that forecasting was a challenge at the moment but something that the CFO was working on to improve.

    3.    The CFO explained that there was a joint audit committee and that papers were public.  A link to this would be sent to the Panel.

    4.    The Commissioner responded by stating that a year ago he could not trust the figures he was given but the CFO was now on top of the problem to the point where he could now trust the figures.

    5.    The Commissioner also pointed out that Surrey had the lowest reserves in the country.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    The Panel noted the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That a link to the online papers for the joint audit committee be sent to the Panel.

     

9/18

OFFICE OF THE POLICE AND CRIME COMMISSIONER 2017/18 END OF YEAR FINANCIAL REPORT pdf icon PDF 45 KB

    The purpose of this report is to inform the Police & Crime Panel of the OPCC’s year-end financial out-turn for the 2017/18 financial year.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    1.    In response to a query about whether Sussex contributed to the internal audit costs of the special audit commissioned for the joint Surrey/Sussex finance function, the CFO explained that it was Surrey that was unhappy with the service provision, so bore this cost.  Further information would be provided to the Panel after the meeting.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    The Panel noted the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That further information on the additional audit costs taken on by Surrey be forwarded to the Panel.

     

10/18

VICTIM SATISFACTION pdf icon PDF 144 KB

    This report sets out how our key services monitor user satisfaction and the wider work undertaken by the OPCC and Surrey Police to monitor this area. The Panel are asked to note the report.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

    1. The Commissioner introduced his report and explained that there would hopefully be improved services from next year when the current provider contract ended.  The services were being brought back in-house in conjunction with the police.  Users would have one point of contact via the new Victim Care Unit.  The Panel welcomed this news.
    2. There were a couple of queries that the Commissioner did not have the answers to and would respond later – these are listed below as further actions.
    3. The Commissioner explained that the take up of victim care services was lower than he would like but that under the new arrangements, this would hopefully be redressed.
    4. An example of good work of police was cited by a Panel Member in respect of a burglary which had been witnessed. It was suggested that the public needed to consider updating their house alarm systems.  The Commissioner would speak with crime reduction officers about this.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    The Panel noted the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That the Commissioner would provide information on the following unanswered queries:

    ·         What percentage choose not be contacted again by the VARC (paragraph 2.3 of the report)?

    ·         What does enhanced and non-enhanced mean (paragraph 2.6 of the report)?

    ·         What are grades 1, 3 and 4 callers?

     

11/18

DEVELOPMENT OF AN INTERNAL VICTIM CARE UNIT pdf icon PDF 189 KB

    This report sets out how the Police and Crime Commissioner (PCC) and Chief Constable have agreed to create an internal Victim Care Unit (VCU) that will provide wraparound, quality care and support for victims of crime in Surrey. This new model will see the cessation of the Office of the Police and Crime Commissioner’s (OPCC) existing contract which has been in place since 2014.  The Panel are asked to note the report.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    1.    The Chairman advised the Commissioner  that Panel members had received a letter from a current service provider but no response had been made, pending this meeting.  The Commissioner explained that the decision for the change of provider was taken after careful consideration.

    1. In response to Member questions the Commissioner reported that funding for any new victim care unit would be through the PCC’s Victim Fund so the Commissioner would be involved and provide support although day to day operations would be by Surrey Police.  He also reported that most of the staff in the new unit would not police.  He would report back later on what ‘priority crime’ meant which was referred to in paragraph 3.1.7 of the submitted report.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    To note the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    Report back on what ‘priority crime’ referred to in paragraph 3.1.7 of the submitted report.

     

12/18

FEEDBACK ON MANAGEMENT MEETINGS BETWEEN THE POLICE AND CRIME COMMISSIONER AND CHIEF CONSTABLE pdf icon PDF 93 KB

    This report provides an update on the meetings that have been held and what has been discussed in order to demonstrate that arrangements for good governance and scrutiny are in place.   

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

    1. There was some misunderstanding on the meaning of the third paragraph on the fourth page of the report.  On the fourth line the word ‘released’ should read ‘detained’.
    2. There was discussion around burglary figures and the Commissioner stated that burglary figures, the number of arrests and solving of crime were higher, but accepted that these figures were still too low.
    3. One Member stated that drug use figures were ‘off the chart’.  The Commissioner explained that whilst the figures were high, the police were on top of the situation in the short term but were more pessimistic about the longer term.  He explained that many drug users thought that it was alright to take drugs which shouldn’t be a crime.  He also stated that where there is demand you will find a supplier.
    4. In response to a Member query about quality of police files and subsequent disclosure of those files, the Commissioner explained that the Chief Constable had received national acclaim for work he had done on disclosure.  He also stated that file quality related to files for the Crown Prosecution Service; especially for rape and sex offence files.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    To note the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That the Panel be sent details of the following:

        a.        The new scorecard

        b.        Update of number of people still wanted for burglary following the HMIPC report

     

13/18

FRAUD UPDATE pdf icon PDF 64 KB

    This report was requested by the Panel (Tracker R4/18) and is for noting.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    1.    In response to questions from the Panel the Commissioner explained that:

              (a)        Whilst 440 crime referrals had been made to Surrey Police only 84 had gone to trial.  That there was a national effort to tackle fraud as it was a growing area for the police.

              (b)        That Operations Signature was a cross-border initiative to help those too embarrassed to report that they were a victim of fraud.  Further details would be sent to Panel Members.

              (c)        That whilst engagement with business did take place it was difficult to get them to report fraud.  It was also recognised that there was little meaningful contact made with businesses, especially amongst the smaller businesses.

              (d)        The police do not have the resources or expertise to deal with banking fraud and therefore these were referred to banks. The police have to concentrate on serious fraud.  He also explained that individual Forces were responsible for the cost of serious fraud investigations and he believed it should be paid for nationally.

              (e)        With regard to the proposed staff changes within the Economic Crime Unit, the Commissioner stated that considerable effort had been made to multi-skill staff and he was confident that the Chief Constable would give this the priority it deserved.

               (f)        The Commissioner confirmed that there was an obligation on banks to report credit card scams but not all did.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    To note the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That details of Operation Signature be provided to Panel Members.

     

14/18

GOVERNANCE OF FIRE AND RESCUE IN SURREY pdf icon PDF 51 KB

    This update report was requested by the Panel (Tracker R14/17) and is for noting.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

    1.    The Commissioner introduced his report and explained that he was waiting for two crucial pieces of information before making a final decision on whether to take on fire governance in the Autumn of 2018.  These were:

    ·         The results of the current inspection of the fire service, and

    ·         The outcome of Hertfordshire’s decision to take on fire governance.

    1. In response to questions, the Commissioner stated that if he were to take on fire governance, this would come out of existing budgets.  He would need to provide a business case and include independent financial viability details.  The KPMG report had not identified any significant savings to be made by the Commissioner taking on fire governance.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    To note the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That an update be provided to the Panel in November 2018.

     

15/18

COMMISSIONER'S QUESTION TIME pdf icon PDF 58 KB

    The Panel is asked to raise any issues or queries concerning crime and policing in Surrey with the Commissioner.

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

     

    A Panel Member asked the Commissioner about future planning and provision of accommodation for key service workers. The Commissioner accepted that relocation of staff would be difficult and that he had looked at this potential problem a few months ago but would take another look at it.

     

16/18

COMPLAINTS RECEIVED SINCE THE LAST MEETING pdf icon PDF 54 KB

17/18

PCP BUDGET 2017/18 pdf icon PDF 88 KB

    The Surrey Police and Crime Panel has accepted a grant from the Home Office to meet the costs of the Panel, including the administrative support.  This paper is to report on the use of the grant in 2017/18.

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

    1. The Chairman introduced the report and confirmed the fact that no Panel Members received an allowance.

    2.    It was noted that Surrey County Council had abolished the Special Responsibility Allowance for scrutiny of the Police and Crime Commissioner, and the concept of a ‘Lead Member’ abandoned and replaced by the designation of an ‘SCC Representative’.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    The Panel noted the report.

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    None.

18/18

RECOMMENDATIONS TRACKER AND FORWARD WORK PROGRAMME pdf icon PDF 53 KB

    To review the Recommendations Tracker and Forward Work Programme.

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key Points raised during discussion:

    1.    The Chairman introduced the Tracker and Forward plan.  There were several items that had previously been suggested by Members but had no details of what was being asked for.  These items were discussed and how they would be handled.

    2.    The Commissioner pointed out that requesting so many formal reports had an effect on his office and staff. Panel Members suggested that not all items required formal reports and some items only required a paragraph of explanation.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    1. To request a short briefing note containing the following items listed in the Forward Plan (Tracker R15/18):

    ·         Use of drones – a Strategic overview.  Is there funding?

    ·         Coercion – What are 'coercive crimes'?

    ·         Neighbourhood Watch – A summary on its current position.

    ·         CCTV Review update – details of where and how this will be provided especially as part of the Estates Strategy.

     

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    That an short briefing note on the above items be provided by the OPCC.

     

19/18

RE-ESTABLISHMENT OF THE COMPLAINTS SUB COMMITTEE pdf icon PDF 64 KB

    To agree the membership and terms of reference for the Complaints Sub-Committee for 2018/19.

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    Key points raised during the discussion:

     

    1. The Panel discussed whether to increase the numbers of Members on the Complaints Sub-Committee as there had been occasions during the previous year when it had been difficult to reach a quorum.

     

    RESOLVED:

     

    1.    That the Complaints Sub Committee membership be increased to seven members.

     

    2.    The Panel agreed the terms of reference for the Complaints Sub- Committee attached at Annex A.

     

    3.    The Panel appointed the following members to the Complaints Sub- Committee for the remainder of the 2018/19 Council year,

     

    -        Cllr Victor Broad

    -        Cllr Margaret Cooksey

    -        Cllr Ken Harwood

    -        Cllr Charlotte Morley

    -        Cllr David Reeve

    -        Independent Member David Fitzpatrick-Grimes

    -        Independent Member Bryan Cross

     

    4.    The Panel agreed the Complaints Protocol, attached at Annex B.

     

    ACTION/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    None.

     

20/18

RE-ESTABLISHMENT OF THE FINANCE SUB GROUP pdf icon PDF 75 KB

    To agree the membership and terms of reference for the Finance Sub-Group for 2018/19.

     

    Additional documents:

    Minutes:

    RESOLVED:

     

    The Panel agreed the terms of reference for the Finance Sub-Group attached at Annex C,

     

    The Panel appointed the following members to the Finance Sub-Group for the remainder of the 2018/19 Council year,

     

    -        Independent Member Bryan Cross

    -        Cllr Josephine Hawkins

    -        Cllr Victor Broad

    -        Chairman

    -        Vice-Chairman

     

    ACTIONS/FURTHER INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED:

     

    None.

     

21/18

DATE OF NEXT MEETING